Dear Mistress Milliscent,

May I remark that for a European, this is a most enlightening post. ;)

Mama mia! You start your post by comparing the inauguration of a nice entertainment park for handicapped children in the State of Washington in 2009, with the euthanasia policies of the nazis in the third Reich, in 1938.

You win. (as you seem intent on opposing a supposed US American model versus a European model.)

This being said, using such arguments, you will always win.

I could point out that the conquest and 'civilisation' of the American continent is simply an annex of European history, that is was carried out mostly by or under the auspices of Europeans, with European values, and that it resulted in the most atrocious genocide of human history. Hundreds of millions of natives (no exaggeration there), and some of the most original and refined civilisations, were simply wiped out. By the way, this was done in the name of the same Christian religion that was so dear to your Founding Fathers, or to their European cousins.

I could point out that your beautiful country so attached to individual liberties maintained a very authoritarian segregationist regime until the 1960s. I could point out that millions of Amerindians (if you want to call them that) were gently pushed and massacred and eventually parked in reservations to starve to death during the great push to the west, this resulting in the genocide, in the territories of the USA alone, of a few millions in a rather short laps of time, about one century actually, between the 19th and the 20th.

All in all, I could point out that the VERY short history of the USA is not less weaved with injustice, atrocities and totalitarianism than the history of most other countries in the world.

I could point out at all these and many other examples that wouldn't make your country appear under a much better light than the "totalitarian" Europe you depict. I could, but it would be, precisely, pointless. As it is pointless to look across the ocean at the other continent and to cherry pick the most outstanding atrocities, just to congratulate oneself on 'how nice are our values compared to theirs.'

There is, in fact, very little difference. Because the very same human beings on both sides of every ocean are prone to commit the very same atrocities in the name of the very same values. You know: patriotism, religion, tradition e tutti quanti. It's all summed up in one thing actually: xenophobia.

All this said in the most respectful and friendly way, because I think your vision of Europe is a bit biased. I love Your posts, I love the way you argument your ideas, but here I was forced to suggest another 'point of view.' ;)

Nanshakh

i agree wholeheartedly, Mistress Milliscent! The unique state of American individualism must be maintained and not sacrificed to whim or expediency.

Nanshakh,

Thank you for your thoughtful comment on my post. I knew that it would generate some measure of concern from those who view things differently, but I also think that it is fair to discuss the fact that our cultures two views of the authority of government are radically different in that one holds the State in primacy, the other the Individual in primacy.

I think your point that the United States was and is an extension of European history and culture is correct so far as it goes. Certainly the United States was founded by people of European extraction and European immigrants, and those people brought the culture and values of the old world to the new. I also think however that our own Revolutionary War was a repudiation and rejection of the worst parts of the philosophy of governance embraced in the old world. It was, when it came to the philosophy of government, a clean break, and a radical departure from Europe. No nation before or since had stated so clearly or powerfully that governments exist only upon the consent of the governed.

My post clearly was not about bdsm, but is not that point one that can be embraced by bdsm folks everywhere? The power of the dominant is rightfully exercised only through the consent of the dominated, in a like manner, is it not best if the power of a government is only rightfully exercised through the consent of the governed?

You are certainly correct that the United States has repeatedly failed to live up to its highest ideals. The United States has done evil to its own citizens, and the citizens of other nations, other cultures. I mentioned that fact in my post.

The United States is not perfect in achieving or maintaining its highest ideals, but is it not better to strive towards the very loftiest of ideals, even if failure is sometimes met, than to not strive towards them at all?

I cannot accept your view that comparisons between the philosophies that underpin the government of the United States and the governments of Europe is pointless. In my view the comparison is vital at this time.

We have had two Presidents in a row who are pushing our nation towards a European philosophy of government. Mr. Bush through ineptitude and ignorance, Mr. Obama through a frank and knowing acceptance of his own philosophy. It is of vital importance that the citizenry of the United States knows what the philosophical differences between our systems of governance are before the acceptance of a foreign philosophy takes place.

I do not post to bash Europe, I’ve no desire to bash Europe, nor do I have a quarrel with Europe. I post to remind my American readers about the philosophy that their fathers and grandfathers found important enough to die for. I post so that America does not accept this European philosophy of government, rejected with violence and war in 1776, without so much as a tear in 2009.

You are certainly correct that there are wonderful people on both sides of the Atlantic Ocean, and indeed evil people on both sides. In about equal measure I would imagine. My post is not about the people of either America or Europe. It is about the governments that govern the people of America and Europe. It is fundamentally about controlling those governments, restraining those governments. A controlled and limited government is the birthright of every American, purchased with the blood of our ancestors, and embodied in our philosophy that a governments just powers are granted through the consent of the governed. It is a philosophy that can act as a restraint on government and should not be abandoned just because a President or two and their Congresses promise tremendous largess in return.

Thank you again for presenting your own point of view, I appreciate having the opportunity to discuss these ideas with you.

M

bitch,

Thank you, and I am pleased that you agree. I don't imagine that many will, but such is the nature of things.

It is, I think, of vital importance that we all remember as we move our nation forward through these economic troubles that:

Individuals are granted the right of self defense by their creator.

Individuals have created government as a way of exercising that right collectively.

As governments legitimate powers arise only through delegation of individual powers, government can have no legitimate power that the individual does not also possess.

These concepts were, in my view, best stated by C. Frederic Bastiat. A European. Unfortunately while his philosophy was widely embraced here, it was not in his own homeland.

M

Dear Lady,

You have said it in an eloquent way. All that you say is true.

However, I fear that many of our voters think that the government will take care of them when they make major mistakes in their lives. This is why the current Congress and administration are in power today. Much damage has been done, and more will be done before we can turn this around. People like you will be key to this goal. I salute you.

Susan's pet,

Thank you. I'm pleased that you enjoyed and agree with the post.

You are certainly correct, we American's have sold out our birthright of liberty for financial dependence on an overly intrusive government.

I hope that it can be turned around, I suppose that the actions of the next Congress will be a good indicator.

M